Signals From Our Statues

[Merlion]

For a statue of this height, it would be prudent for the sculptor to recommend installing lightning arrestor, wouldn't it?

Signals From Our Statues (http://thelede.blogs.nytimes.com/2007/05/21/signals-from-our-statues/)

When lighting strikes a holier-than-most location like the Mother Cabrini Shrine in Golden, Colo., only small quantities of faith and/or imagination are needed to see the possibilities for divine actions. After all, she was the first American citizen canonized as a Roman Catholic saint.

When the lightning strike actually hits a 33-foot statue of Jesus at the aforementioned shrine, shearing off his left arm, right hand and a piece of a foot, it’s even easier to jump to conclusions.

The shrine’s Sister Ilaria was there to bring some sobriety to the aftermath. It came from the heavens, she told The Denver Post, but it was not a sign from the heavens. ....

http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2007/05/21/us/statue.jpg

[Merlion]

The nuns who maintain the statue seem to know their job. But they didn't think of installing lightning arrestor.

Cabrini statue of Jesus can be fixed (http://www.denverpost.com/headlines/ci_5951695)

The 33-foot statue of Jesus at Mother Cabrini Shrine that was struck by lightning over the weekend can be fixed, the nuns who maintain the statue said Monday. ...

The Missionary Sisters of the Sacred Heart of Jesus and staff at the shrine are working with an insurance company and structural engineers to assess the damage.

A cost assessment will likely be completed within a week, said Sister Bernadette Casciano, administrator of the Mother Cabrini Shrine.

"An inspection group looked at it today and said the statue could still sustain strong winds, so I think we'll go ahead and get it repaired," she said.

It was sent from Italy in five stackable sections in 1954. ....

The shrine gets thousands of visitors a year who climb the 373 stairs to the sacred heart statue.

Mother Frances Xavier Cabrini was the first American citizen canonized as a saint by the Roman Catholic Church. ....

This picture below is from another source (http://www.rockymountainnews.com/drmn/local/article/0,1299,DRMN_15_5548693,00.html). You can see that it stands high up on open ground.

http://mas.scripps.com/DRMN/2007/05/21/434962338_o.jpg

[fritchie]

An odd occurance, but it's been there over fifty years, apparently without anything similar, or the earlier tale probably would have been recalled.

There are very tall statues around the world these days, some much bigger, and I don't know how they are protected. It would be not too difficult to install an internal grounding rod when one is installed, but a later addition could be unsightly. Nice to see this one apparently will be refreshed.

[sculptor]

I wonder
could a statue be designed to intentionally attract lightning?
and do so repeatedly?

'twould be a fitting monument for Nicola Tesla (about whom and whose statue we typed in an earlier thread)

[evaldart]

What about De Maria's classic "lightning Fields". It even looked good without a storm, all those shiny poles glistening in the sunshine.

[Merlion]

There are very tall statues around the world these days, some much bigger, and I don't know how they are protected. .
I made a search for the answer and was told that the sculptors would first have to pray and offer sacrifices to Zeus, the king of the Gods, as he is also the king of the sky and thunder. :)

I quote.
"Aside from forced transformation, Zeus is known to punish those who veered out of his pleasure with lightning bolts."

Or if you prefer, you can pray to Saint Barbara. Among many other things, she is patron saint against lightning.

I quote.
"Patron Saint against death by artillery, against explosions, against fire, against impenitence, against lightning, against mine collapse, against storms, ammunition magazines, ammunition workers, architects, armourers, artillery, artillerymen, boatmen, bomb technicians, brass workers, brewers, builders, carpenters, construction workers, dying people, explosives workers, fire, fire prevention, firefighters, fireworks, fireworks manufacturers, fortifications, founders, geologists, gravediggers, gunners, hatmakers, hatters, lightning, mariners, martyrs, masons, mathematicians, military engineers, milliners, miners, ordnance workers, prisoners, safety from storms, sailors, saltpetre workers, smelters, stone masons, stonecutters, storms, sudden death, Syria, tilers, warehouses, watermen."

By the way, note the mention of stone masons. Are stone carvers included ?

[philpraxis]

no... for sculptors it's Saint Chisel.
:)

[Merlion]

Note, the word is against, not for. :confused:

[Merlion]

Continuing my search what can be done to tall statues for protection against lightning, I note the aim of any devices is to 'dissipate' the very high electric charge at the clouds above, to avoid a lighning discharge through the tall statues.

Even well grounded tall metal statues cannot avoid being struck by lightning bolts. The very high voltage lightning strikes the metal statue and goes through it to the ground, melting and denting the spot where it strikes.

Dissipation of electric charges is best by pointed non-rusting metal rods positioned at the highest points and firmly connected by copper strips to say water pipes in the ground. Even sharp bends and loose connections at the copper strips are to be avoided.

Here are quotes about past practices.

"In the 1990s, the 'lightning points' were replaced as originally constructed when the statue of Freedom atop the United States Capitol building in Washington was restored. The statue was designed with multiple devices which are tipped with platinum. The original aluminum cap of the Washington Monument was also equipped with multiple lightning points, and the rays that radiate from the crown of the Statue of Liberty in New York Harbor constitute a lightning-dissipation device."

"The bronze Statue of Freedom by Thomas Crawford is the crowning feature of the dome of the United States Capitol..... Ten bronze points tipped with platinum are attached to her headdress, shoulders, and shield for protection from lightning."

[sculptor]

more at lightning
thanx evaldart...interesting reading,/re lightning fields

A quick perusal of the literature, and it seems that there are many events.effects for which we use the tern ...lightning
it seems that the most common cloud to earth is negative discharge lightning
the mechanism seems to work thusly..
..first the thunderhead separates its charges with the top of the cloud going positive, and the bottom negative--------the negatively charged cloud bottom changes the grounds charge by driving free electrons deeper into the ground, leaving the surface of the ground positively charged
when the disparity of the ground/cloud charges reaches a sufficient level(dependent on atmospheric moisture and temperature) the clouds free electrons seek out positive charges and rush to unite.
sometimes the negative charge overwhelms the positive charge leaving the ground negatively charged
then the positively charged top of the cloud may discharge by drawing free electrons from the ground-------creating what is referred to as a positive discharge----it seems that this is a relatively rare ocurance (<5%)
and is a quantum leap more powerful than the negative discharge....

if the above be accurate,
building a statue which is intended to attract and capture lightning
should be a simple matter of using a darned powerful dc generator (protectively isolated by sacrificial diodes or fusing)to positively charge electrodes placed at strategic locations to attract the negative discharge lightning----
for a tesla statue, I would place these in his upraised hands-reaching into the thunderclouds to capture the dancing photons-as the magical master of lightning-------for a grand finale---reverse the charge at the appropriate time, and capture the positive discharge----
perpetual maintenence to replace the melted electrodes and isolation mechanisms

seems doable?
thoughts?

rod

[Merlion]

After so many months, we have follow-up news of this Jesus statue struck by lightning. It costs $200,000 to restore it. Fortunately 60% of this sum is covered by insurance.

Unfortunately, no effective lightning arrestor was installed.

Work Begins On Jesus Statue Struck By Lightning (http://www.thedenverchannel.com/news/14136048/detail.html)

Sept 17, 2007, GOLDEN, Colo. -- Restoration work is beginning on a metro area landmark that draws people from all around the world.

Lightning hit the large statue of Jesus at the Mother Cabrini Shrine in May and knocked off its arms, feet and part of the 11-foot base. It took four months of research with the insurance company, engineers and contractors to determine how to fix the 22-foot statue.

On Monday, officials with the shrine said that restoration work is starting now and should take about three months at a cost of $200,000. Insurance is covering 60 percent of that cost ....

Repairs begin on lightning-damaged shrine (http://www.9news.com/news/local/article.aspx?storyid=77481)

Sept 17, 2007, GOLDEN – Repairs began Monday ....

The lightning strike damaged the arms, feet and base of the Statue of the Sacred Heart of Jesus on May 19.

Work to fix the statue is expected to take around 90 days.

Saint Frances Xavier Cabrini established the Mother Cabrini Shrine as a summer camp for orphans. In 1954, the statue was brought from Northern Italy to the foothills beyond Golden.

[Landseer]

Another rightwing article of idolatry is damaged by an act of nature, and the rest of us pay the cost for this religious idol's repairs thru increased INSURANCE premiums;

"are working with an insurance company" In other words, an insurance company whose LOSSES of 60% of $200,000 ($120,000) we all pay for with increased car, health and home insurance premiums.

No, it's NOT fortunate insurance will cover 60%, it's UNfortunate for the rest of us. Since churches are tax exempt while sucking off the rest of us who work and PAY taxes, they can damn well pay for repairs to THEIR tax exempt property out of their fat bank accounts, or sell a few of those GOLD candlesticks and stained glass windows, or better yet take out a loan on that nice tax exempt $350 million, 48,000 sq ft copper roofed cathedral in downtown Los Angeles,
the purchase price of the 5.6 acres of land was $10.85 million alone. I'm sure their coffers are stuffed full of enough tax exempt cash their sheeple donated, to cover the repair.

I object to my money being used in any way for this article of idoltry, I don't care if it's 1/10,000th of a cent- tear it down instead.
Thanks for the article, I'll forward it to the people at atheists.org so it will get more exposure.

[GlennT]

Landseer;

To be intellectually honest, you can't go running to the insurance company if lighting strikes down your golden calf!

[Landseer]

Landseer;

To be intellectually honest, you can't go running to the insurance company if lighting strikes down your golden calf!And what the hell do you mean by THAT exactly?

[GlennT]

That was just an attempt at some humor for a reality check, on the slight chance that you were taking this anti-religion thing a bit too seriously. My mistake!

[Landseer]

on the slight chance that you were taking this anti-religion thing a bit too seriously. My mistake!I see, well NOW you know better.
Maybe a viewing of that movie at zeitgeistmovie.com will help understand religion better, the clip is three parts- total of 2 hours long but the religion expose' starts after 9 minutes of visuals and is part one in that movie.

People see that and a whole lot of things become a lot clearer on the fraud of organized Western religion.

[WeiMingKai]

If you have an insurance policy that covers your Idols and acts of nature then by all means you should be able to make a claim when it gets damaged. I don't see the problem with filing a claim at all.

The insurance contract was between the statue owners and the insurance company - that's it - you can grind an axe of anti-idolatry opinion all you like but that doesn't and shouldn't have any effect on who gets a claim filled under the terms of a policy they purchased.

Begrudging someone access to something like an insurance policy because you don't approve of what they believe is not exactly reasonable. It reminds me of the 'reasonableness' of people who complain about anyone who lives in the Mississippi flood plain 'why should anyone help them when it floods! they knew it would happen!' - same thing for Earthquake, Tornado and Hurricane prone areas i.e.; 'those people are DUMB - they need to move and not live where stuff happens!' or 'they're dumb - they have giant statues - what they need to do is NOT have giant statues'.

Question for the board:
What is a 'Lightning Arrestor' - is that the same thing as a lightning rod - aka a wire running from the top of a thing to some kind of ground/metal stake at the bottom of a thing to give a lightning strike a path of least resistance to follow? They could probably sneak a wire running top to bottom into a fold of the statues robe and improve its lightning resistance considerably.

[Landseer]

I don't see the problem with filing a claim at all.
Of course you wouldn't, forgetting for the moment the church is TAX EXEMPT, but they foist their bills off on the rest of us. The insurance companies are a business, and this frivolous waste of money repairing this article of idolatry so that it will be hit again by lightening is one reason why insurance rates are as high as they are.

The insurance contract was between the statue owners and the insurance company
If I was part of that insurance company, the church wouldn't GET a policy in the first place.

reminds me of the 'reasonableness' of people who complain about anyone who lives in the Mississippi flood plain 'why should anyone help them when it floods! they knew it would happen!' - same thing for Earthquake, Tornado and Hurricane prone areas i.e.;
Exactly- and those people in those multi-million dollar mansions on the beach, or in known quake fault zones that have serious quakes and mud slides every 5-10 years are the same problem, they KNOW their house will be wiped out and they continue to rebuild it in the SAME location as before knowing full well that when the house is destroyed yet again, they get another new one and all new furniture for 1/10th the cost- the paltry amount of premiums they will pay over the next 5 years.

Ditto for New Orleans, a city that is TEN FEET below sea level and sinking every year, and it WILL flood again.


They could probably sneak a wire running top to bottom into a fold of the statues robe and improve its lightning resistance considerably.Better yet, the church could demolish it and put a smaller one inside their CHURCH- just an idea!

[sculptor]

Another rightwing article of idolatry is damaged by an act of nature(Read GOD), ...

an alternate view:
Maybe, they done sumpin to tick GOD off....
Sunday Christians and ...(Monday capitalists?)?

and...lightning rods attract lightning
if the wire is wet , and in an inclosed area...
could have some fun with steam?


dinner awaits a diner
bye fer now

[Landseer]

an alternate view:
Maybe, they done sumpin to tick GOD off....
Sunday Christians and ...(Monday capitalists?)?

and...lightning rods attract lightning
if the wire is wet , and in an inclosed area...
could have some fun with steam?
Ha, maybe, but when ever it's something that happens that is bad it's always excused as "its gods will" or "god works in mysterious ways". A tsunami from his earth he designed supposedly moving a little wipes out 100,000 people plus untold animals and it's "god works in mysterious ways" someone wins the lottery and its "god blessed him" - must have blessed ALL the filthy rich mo-fo's too who made billions off the working people, World-com, Enron, Bill Gates, the oil companies, Bush/Cheney, Haliburton, Blackwater, the list goes on.

Steam yeah, a wire inside that sucker hit by lightning could crack the thing in more pieces!

[sculptor]

..."?
"a rich man could no sooner enter heaven than a camel could pass through the eye of a needle"?

did i remember that correctly?

[Merlion]

Question for the board:
What is a 'Lightning Arrestor' - is that the same thing as a lightning rod - aka a wire running from the top of a thing to some kind of ground/metal stake at the bottom of a thing to give a lightning strike a path of least resistance to follow? They could probably sneak a wire running top to bottom into a fold of the statues robe and improve its lightning resistance considerably.
We are no expert on this. My post #9 above is related to this matter and may clarify some of your points.

[sculptor]

Originally Posted by WeiMingKai
Question for the board:
What is a 'Lightning Arrestor' -
We are no expert on this. My post #9 above is related to this matter and may clarify some of your points.

may I add:
normally, what is known as "lightning arrestors" are commonly surge suppressors in electrical supplies these will dampen via resistors a voltage surge and when all else fails, blow like a fuse or circuit breaker---if the lightning is in the line, it would most likely short to ground

on a large scale---the attempt to supress lightning via resistors would produce heat till the resistors blew, then continue on it's merry way

alternately phrased:
THOR is the god who controls lightning
he hates the giants, hill trolls, and the proud ones
and visits them with lightning and thunder
if you would not suffer his wrath
be humble
if your vanity would lead you to build your icons proudly atop the hills,
know that he is watching and waiting and will visit your vanity in his good time

[GlennT]

[QUOTE=Landseer] ALL the filthy rich mo-fo's too who made billions off the working people, World-com, Enron, Bill Gates, the oil companies, Bush/Cheney, Haliburton, Blackwater, the list goes on.
QUOTE]

Not sure why I'm bothering, but I would like to point out that without the genius and initiative of some of these "filthy rich mo-fo's" like Bill Gates, etc., we would not be communicating on this forum, using computers, having gas to run our cars or heat our homes, have cars to drink gas, have some of the jobs that feed us, and have a thousand other convienences and securities that keep us living a life of relative abundance where we have the luxury of creating art and disagreeing over the content of it.

Are those people at the top of the wealth chain not working people? they just got their wealth from snapping their fingers?

Don't expect that by pointing this out I believe that the present system is perfect. Just offering some perspective.


" And God said, " Let there be Lightning.." , and the rest of us got out of the way.." Govinda Ballgame, Ch. 5, V. 3 from the NoProbBobakananda Tablets

[jOe~]

Yup, yup, yup. Life just ain't fair! Why? Whats love got to do with it? Where is the messiah when we need her?

[Landseer]

If I did a jesus statue with his head stuck up a horse's ASS and put it on display and call it art, they wouldn't know the meaning of insulting their icons- and with that one I could show them exactly how it's done.

-----
god doesnt bless people, the lord doesnt help people, and prayers dont work.

www.zeitgeistmovie.com (http://www.zeitgeistmovie.com/)
www.atheists.org (http://www.atheists.org/)
www.evilbible.com (http://www.evilbible.com/)

[fritchie]

Landseer - I try to avoid criticizing anyone's opinion, as long as it's reasonable and not overly insulting, but I think you should take a moment to reflect on what you have posted just in the last day or so. Overall, I think you have been a very valuable and understanding contributor, and I'm surprised at the recent posts.

[fritchie]

WeiMingKai - A lightning suppressor or lightning rod is a device of some sort to carry a lightning discharge away from a "protected area" such as a building, a statue, or possibly even an especially valuable and tall tree.

As has been said above, these things today often are electronic, and may almost instantaneously isolate (in an electrical sense) a protected area from external conductors or entering paths for electricity. A century ago, many large buildings were protected by "lightning rods" running from one or more peaks of the roof, straight to the ground, where they were attached to buried metal rods.

My Swiss - American grandmother lived in a home (here in Louisiana) that was protected by a steel cable about 1/2 inch in diameter. It ran from one high spot on the roof, down to the ground, though I never looked carefully at the details. I suspect it was isolated from the roof and external walls by isolating posts of some sort. I didn't know of any other homes similarly protected, and always assumed it came from her background in the high mountains where lightning strikes probably were more common.

[Landseer]

Landseer - I try to avoid criticizing anyone's opinion, as long as it's reasonable and not overly insulting, but I think you should take a moment to reflect on what you have posted just in the last day or so. Overall, I think you have been a very valuable and understanding contributor, and I'm surprised at the recent posts.Fritchie, you are a good fellow, and I don't need to reflect on my posts, I know what I posted and I stand by them 100%

I am totally frustrated and fed up with this religious nonsense, it's bad enough to have read the crap in news articles, politics, political ads and all the rest without coming in here and reading MORE of it on a sculpture site, least of all the recent news items deliberately selected out of hundreds out there and posted here that just ooze religious propaganda.

I'ts to the point now where, I feel like I'm walking into church when I read some of the posts here, and while I like this site and the input, the almost daily annoyance with this religion crap is rapidly making me re-think my further participation here.

[sculptor]

randall
some people derive a great benefit from a belief in something beyond themselves
call it a deity, universal love, even adherence to a political concept,,,etc..\
if they wish to share their joy/contentment/feeling of "every thing is for the best"...whatever
they do it out of compassion

I think I understand your conflicts/religion resentments (maybe I'm being a tad over confident here_)
whatever...
take it as a gift
accept the potential bigotry with the possibility of good intentions and ...

you have a love and respect for the craftsmen/craftsmanship of bygone eras and have delighted my eyes with your passions acquisitions and recreations

I appreciate all your posts and hope you can at least tolerate the sharing of those who have found contentment through their deities

personally, i am with Kierkegaard and beyond his knight of infinite resignation, think that all religions are facets of the undefinable
each false (in it's ...centricity) and each a true viewpoint of the ultimate of "that which is beyond our ken or ability to conceive or describe"

i cannot but accept the occasional exclusivity for the vision of the faceted concept ( though, to hear me tell it, you might well conceive that I have grown intolerant of intolerance...speaking of your average conundrum)

i'm a tad drunk and rambling
this is the only place i read you dude
you enrich me
i'd really miss you
maudlin 'nuff?

type whatever comes to mind
yours
rod
ps
loved the recent brownstone posted

[racine]

it is a curious fact that lightning rods also increase the chance of strike, may i suggest a prophylactic , insulatory approach? giant condoms, a good signal from sister Donna on world aids day?