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-   -   David (http://www.sculpture.net/community/showthread.php?t=8619)

evaldart 12-14-2008 06:51 PM

David
 
Anyone know of any good David sculptures besides the big four (Mike, Donatello, Verrochio, Bernini)? And while we're on the subject, which is your fave?

I love the severed head in the Verrochio, but, like the Donatello, cant get past the (un)physiques. I'm kinda worn out on Mike's by the overexposure, but is SO big it has to win. Sorry B, like the intensity but more is, after all, more.

(the reason for all this histry stuff will become apparent hopefully by may).

jOe~ 12-14-2008 06:55 PM

Re: David
 
Well if you mean to hint that you're going to have your say at it, I say pretty freekin' cool because they need re-visioning.

StevenW 12-14-2008 07:28 PM

Re: David
 
Antonin Mercie did one in the 1800's that was okay, after he chops Goliath's head off (kinda like your santa so maybe you'll like it).. :D


I've read my fair share about Mikey and David and am biased, the others are just plain sissified next to it except perhaps Bernini's and his was a little too river dance for me.

GlennT 12-14-2008 07:53 PM

Re: David
 
Bernini's is the one in the group that looks like he means business. The others look like well concieved sculptures. Mercie's is an interesting study of mood, form, and beauty, but somehow doesn't bring me any closer to imagining that it represents the historical David.

In my estimation, all of these works are great sculptures for varius reasons, but none of them created the definitive David whereby you look at it and acknowledge that must be what David was like. For that, we still await the inspired sculptor...

jOe~ 12-14-2008 09:09 PM

Re: David
 
Quote:

none of them created the definitive David whereby you look at it and acknowledge that must be what David was like. For that, we still await the inspired sculptor...
Perhaps it will take a woman.

grommet 12-14-2008 09:18 PM

Re: David
 
well Roberrrrrr(t) wears a skirt, does that count?

evaldart 12-14-2008 09:34 PM

Re: David
 
Often good things come from the times you're working blindfolded and dizzied, thrusting wildly in the air til the donkey tail finally gets pinned to the curtains (remove blindfold, get your bearings and admire the new decor). Other times its nice when something stops you firm by the shoulders and shoves you towards the donkey's ass. Figuration supplies me with that aiming (but I keep the blindfold on because theres nothing better than the surprise at the end of it all).

GlennT 12-14-2008 10:19 PM

Re: David
 
Please tell me you take off the blindfold when you are using the power tools!

evaldart 12-27-2008 07:34 PM

Re: David
 
While fueling the dynamic duo (or Laurel and Hardy) for another significant undertaking with sandwiches and some reading, I came accross this passage from "Michelangelos David: A Search for Identity" by Charles Seymour, jr -

"Perhaps art historians have tended to concentrate too much on re-search and too little on the origional search. They have been dazzled by facets of re-discovery. And they have accordingly written more about results than about process. As their materials they have used acquired facts rather than recovering, insofar as may be possible, the living experience of the artistic process. With this attitude it is possible to become unwitting prisoners to an idea of history as a mechanical movement forward to a preconceived goal, and committed to an idea of art history that,without our quite knowing how or why, has become so deliberately determined that it is dehumanized."

Here is an example of an honest scribbler, more likely to actually GET whats to be gotten from artworks based on his own self-evaluatory approach to the work and his willingness to wonder about "being" an artist...as opposed to just being a writer stretching truths and belaboring facts.

And if you change that one word up there "historians" to "artists" you have yet another interesting and revealing notion.

jOe~ 12-27-2008 08:47 PM

Re: David
 
Quote:

"Perhaps art historians have tended to concentrate too much on re-search and too little on the origional search
I find the re-search mindset all too common in "opinions" expressed. What stands out is an amazing inability to see the art thing, to experience it, to be aware of ones interaction with it, how one participates in creating a reality for it in the guise of an original opinion supported only by "conventional" " thinking" , i.e., re-search. The original search is rare because it involves relating to the making, the trials and triumphs, the accomplishments, the potential ways of viewing, and, your role in all this as a unique viewer. Its that inner freedom thing, again, v.s.becoming an " unwitting prisoners to an idea". That is why I love strange work that I've never seen before. Its so much easier to like it.

Duck 12-27-2008 09:32 PM

Re: David
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by evaldart (Post 69793)
Anyone know of any good David sculptures besides the big four

Check out the first 30 minutes of “Children of Men”…

evaldart 12-27-2008 11:39 PM

Re: David
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by jOe~ (Post 70564)
I find the re-search mindset all too common in "opinions" expressed. What stands out is an amazing inability to see the art thing, to experience it, to be aware of ones interaction with it, how one participates in creating a reality for it in the guise of an original opinion supported only by "conventional" " thinking" , i.e., re-search. The original search is rare because it involves relating to the making, the trials and triumphs, the accomplishments, the potential ways of viewing, and, your role in all this as a unique viewer. Its that inner freedom thing, again, v.s.becoming an " unwitting prisoners to an idea". That is why I love strange work that I've never seen before. Its so much easier to like it.

Nice, Joe. Seems like you "get it"...most of the time:D.

Aaron Schroeder 12-28-2008 01:57 AM

Re: David
 
If I ever did a " David ", I'd focus on depicting the action that David is known for, throwing a rock hard, fast and far. Perhaps the wind up or the moment of release.

During my early years I experimented with using a sling and found it to be a fun activity. Once I was roughly a hundred yards from a very expensive university satellite dish and thought it would be a worthy target, never thinking I'd hit it I let a stone fly. The launch was perfect and the stone arced high and long. As I watch my rock descending I felt a sense of panick, my fun and games all of a sudden taking on a real world seriousness. The impact was very loud. I didn't get in trouble or anything but I realized that slings are no joke. Even a kid can deliver a seriously hard punch, all it takes is a well made sling and practice.

If you've never made a sling and thrown some stones, give it a try, it's alot of fun, just watch what you aim for, you might just hit it.

evaldart 12-28-2008 11:03 AM

Re: David
 
Right Aaron, the EVENT of the story provides for some great sculptural opportunity. But its so hard to resist the "triumph" involved. The accomplished feat of heroism, the severed giant head...

Figuration and representation provides the priviledge of a more elongated experience with the matter. Whereas my abstractions are very "session" oriented...small or large, they happen very "immediately".

Of course this David thing is just another excuse to tangle with some heavy steel - and as in any worthy project, the success of the piece will be decided there-in.

mountshang 12-28-2008 11:55 AM

Re: David
 
1 Attachment(s)
Here's a "David" by Nathan Rapoport -- well, it's actually a monument to Mordechai Anielewicz, a leader of the Warsaw Ghetto uprising -- but it obviously has David in mind.

BTW -- it is curious that "David" is such a rare subject -- outside the famous four outstanding examples from Renaissance and Baroque Italy.

evaldart 12-28-2008 08:09 PM

Re: David
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by mountshang (Post 70588)
Here's a "David" by Nathan Rapoport -- well, it's actually a monument to Mordechai Anielewicz, a leader of the Warsaw Ghetto uprising -- but it obviously has David in mind.

BTW -- it is curious that "David" is such a rare subject -- outside the famous four outstanding examples from Renaissance and Baroque Italy.

Right M, it takes a very special rock tosser to be a giant killer. I too am surprised that the theme has been rarely addressed. Was Rodin chickenshit?

StevenW 12-29-2008 12:34 PM

Re: David
 
When I think of the David, I imagine Screech up against Andre the Giant in a smack-down ring with Kelly Kelly (always Kelly Kelly) on the outskirts smiling and looking commodity-like in mannequinesse appearance. I just can't get past the comic elements enough to envision anything "working".. Maybe this is why Glenn said it has yet to be done the way he envisions it.. Biblical events become almost comic-book-like in my mind and today the "hero" or "heroin" has been reduced to an; almost ex-junkie with tattoos and nose piercings and one-dimensional parents who wouldn't let him or her pursue their true-calling or stay out past 10 pm.
In the digital thread I saw a glimpse of something, not sure what, a why perhaps, a tectonic plate in my mind snapping suddenly to release zettajoules of energy, a big slamming of the brakes. The rhythm of Art, the labor of love, the event, the intensity,... Perhaps the digital allows us to skip the "labor" part so that it is simply a narcissism or a love of love and a constant hum and scrape of an axis mill replacing the rhythm of a hammer-stroke. The intensity becomes swallowed up and spat out like some kind of bizarre Dr. Sues machine... Imperative will rescue the piece I think, before that Suesonian character shows up.

evaldart 12-29-2008 10:50 PM

Re: David
 
Nothing wrong with comic book heros for inspiration either. If I were a stone guy I'd carve the most marvelous Vampirella you ever saw. And with the right approach...it'd be well within my scope of "finest of the fine". But approach is everything...point of view...how do you turn it into a battle that you almost lose (or maybe you do lose...stinker) and how do you NOT make it just talk about Vampirella. How do you make it proclaim its sculptureness with resounding confidence and force (and an itty bitty bitty unitard)?

StevenW 12-29-2008 11:03 PM

Re: David
 
lol, dont know about the unitard, thin carving there, but I agree, comics, cartoons, humor,.. Maybe all that is left to explore is the absurd and unlikely,...For all I know 100 years from now they'll see it as our finest hour..

Aaron Schroeder 12-30-2008 02:21 AM

Re: David
 
Every " David " I've seen is just lame. Sure, I love all sculpture.....but If I could see a full-out " David ", under tension, caught in the moment, charged with visceral power, that would be best.

Who wants to see another static, standing still " David " ?

If I was up against Goliath, I'd be on fire, muscles tense, ripped, focused, harsh. Picture that. All behind a rock.

In the art history classes of the future, they'll show all the " weak " Davids, then they'll show the kick ass David and all the students will see the difference.

obseq 12-30-2008 05:19 AM

Re: David
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by evaldart (Post 70671)
If I were a stone guy I'd carve the most marvelous Vampirella you ever saw. And with the right approach...it'd be well within my scope of "finest of the fine".


Admit it-- You wrote that as a challenge to yourself. Have at it!!! :D ;)

grommet 12-30-2008 09:40 AM

Re: David
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by StevenW (Post 70672)
lol, dont know about the unitard, thin carving there, but I agree, comics, cartoons, humor,.. Maybe all that is left to explore is the absurd and unlikely,...For all I know 100 years from now they'll see it as our finest hour..

perhaps your absurd and unlikely is another person's starting point of possibility, plausible and attainable.

evaldart 01-02-2009 07:24 PM

Re: David
 
1 Attachment(s)
As things begin, here we go. I am planning to have a major "David" piece completed for a May show. For fun, I will include every stage of this sculpture in this thread/ Here is the first sketch (much influenced by our friend Aaron). Hes right, gotta get him in the ACT. Imagine 12 to 15 feet H.

grommet 01-02-2009 07:30 PM

Re: David
 
Are you sure your name's not Calvin?:rolleyes:

evaldart 01-03-2009 09:12 AM

Re: David
 
The problem with the "action" stances is that they will require a spread of the feet that will screw up the pedistalization. One of the things that makes the Michelangelo version so powerful is the height. The pedistal really gets it up there...achieves a proper "dwarfing". A wides stance will ask for more of a "platform" which cannot agree compositionally at a great height.
Plain ol' life-and-a-half aint gonna do it this time....got to get him WAAAY up there (I'll probably be building yet another lifting apparatus for this one, or yank it up one of the trees).


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