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  #1  
Old 11-14-2008, 08:07 PM
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zazie zazie is offline
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What do you think about this work

I love most of the work of this sculptor (except for her wrestlers and the category "inclassables." My style is evolving in a totally different direction but in a parallel universe I would be doing that kind of work.


I would like to know how this audience reacts to Mady's work.

www.madyandrien.com
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  #2  
Old 11-14-2008, 08:31 PM
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Re: What do you think about this work

Her groupings are quite well done because the huddled nature informs a primitve and absurd brand of restrained surrealism, not unlike George segal, that is allowed to ignore figurative specificities and overcome academic evaluations. Her other figures though, as considered individually or in pairs, suffer greatly by the same stiffness and exerted gesture that is often seen the work of beginners. Not good at all. And I wont talk about the steel silhouettes that she had nothing at all to do with.

Liek all of us, she has plenty still to accomplish (and this has nothing to do with getting commissions).
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Old 11-14-2008, 09:09 PM
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Re: What do you think about this work

Evaldart leads the way on this one. I'd like to see more energy and exaggeration. Most follow too closely to realism while using obviously non realistic materials. I don't feel she is getting all there is to be gotten out of her approach. There used to be a poster, cmustard. He used materials differently and made them talk in a unique, idiosyncratic way. I loved his work and miss it. Herehttp://www.sculpture.net/community/a...0&d=1162824624 is a couple examples(can't find the great photos)http://www.sculpture.net/community/a...9&d=1162824554
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  #4  
Old 11-14-2008, 09:23 PM
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Re: What do you think about this work

Thanks for taking the time to comments.

When I look at Mady's sculptures I experience a sense of humanity that moves me - I especially like a grouping called "les copains d'abord." My goal, though with a long road in front of me - but the journey is the joy ... ) is to capture some basics feeling in my own sculpture or as better expressed by Victor Shklovsky:

"And art exists that one may recover the sensation of life; it exists to make one feel things ..."

Joe the pictures you showed make me recoil as I find them quite ugly though I try hard not to make "pretty" sculptures either.

Is all that talk of humanity mush?
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Old 11-14-2008, 09:49 PM
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Re: What do you think about this work

"And Art exists that one may recover the sensation of life, it exists to make one feel things."

These words are nice but actually seem to underestimate the potential of Art. "recovery" implies a loss, it speaks of a re-gaining instead of an adding-to. Experiencing Art and considering aesthetics is an act of growth and strengthening. Art is not there to "repair" it is there to improve or better what it touches. and "feeling things" is too vague, too inclusive, too universal... BUT...get a load of this Schklovsky piece of verbosity:

"The purpose of art is to impart the sensation of things as they are perceived and not as they are known. The technique of art is to make objects 'unfamiliar', to make forms difficult, to increase the difficulty and length of perceptionbecause the process of perception is an end in itself and must be prolonged. Art is a way of experiencing the artfulness of an object; the object is not important."

As scibblers go, thats pretty damn on the money. Thanks for bringing him into the discussion, Z.
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  #6  
Old 11-15-2008, 12:07 AM
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Re: What do you think about this work

I did not post the longer quote because the bit about technique bothers me - too much an end in itself, like acrobatics.

My impression is that the American public and therefore many figurative artists focus too much on technique at the detriment of emotions, what is sometimes described as emotions is, to me, epidermic sentimentality.

Looking at the work of sculptor friends who sell in Europe, it appears that European buyers are not enthralled with in-your-face demonstration of technical skills as they are with the emotions a piece capture.

Hence, let me quote someone closer to home. I lifted this bit a while ago from one of GlennT's messages. I wish I had come up with it myself because it captures exactly what I desire to achieve right now and what I think Mady achieves in her own style .

" My hope is that whoever may see [my work] will draw some positive inspiration from it, perhaps no more than a momentary lifting of the burdens that they carry."
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Old 11-15-2008, 04:05 AM
Musicman92130 Musicman92130 is offline
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Re: What do you think about this work

You guys use a lot of big words. I think Zazie is on to something about expressing a feeling. If you look at an artist like Marino Marini I find his power is he expresses the sensation of something about to happen with his horses. He expresses that unseen quality that hits you in the gut. I took a workshop with Lincoln Fox and he described it as haptic distortion. I think it is a word he made up.

But I thought the website showed some promise but I couldn't get past how stiff the figures were in their poses. It wasn't congruent with the sensation of passion or love that she was trying to convey. And as far as the European view on art, figurative sculpture is even less popular there than it is here. There still seems to be this trend of abstract art, especially in France that is popular. When I was studying in Italy over the Summer I met a ton of European figurative sculptors. But there seems to be a trend of it coming back, especially in Ireland for some reason. But I saw no real difference on how they preceive art.

And about the purpose of art, well I think it can be anything. Picasso once remarked that art can kill when he saw an African club with figures sculpted on it. And there is a beautifully decorated cannon in the Borgello in Florence that killed a lot of people.

Mark
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Old 11-15-2008, 08:26 AM
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Re: What do you think about this work

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Originally Posted by zazie View Post
I did not post the longer quote because the bit about technique bothers me - too much an end in itself, like acrobatics.

My impression is that the American public and therefore many figurative artists focus too much on technique at the detriment of emotions, what is sometimes described as emotions is, to me, epidermic sentimentality.

Looking at the work of sculptor friends who sell in Europe, it appears that European buyers are not enthralled with in-your-face demonstration of technical skills as they are with the emotions a piece capture.

Hence, let me quote someone closer to home. I lifted this bit a while ago from one of GlennT's messages. I wish I had come up with it myself because it captures exactly what I desire to achieve right now and what I think Mady achieves in her own style .

" My hope is that whoever may see [my work] will draw some positive inspiration from it, perhaps no more than a momentary lifting of the burdens that they carry."
Well of course Glenn can assemble a pleasurable sentence. He a sculptor...and when you can sculpt, all other forms of art are easy...others only requiring around half of you're creative ability. But theres a problem there with his professed intention of lifting others out of their misery. That cannot be the goal of the created object. Save that energy for painting grape-leaves along their ceiling trim, that will uplift them just fine. If Glenn really wants to "give" anything to humanity he will sculpt, for himself, a twenty-foot St Sebastion out of stone. He will be so enriched by the task that he will bubble and spew pertinece enough that everyone will get some. THAT is how you actually help your species.
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  #9  
Old 11-15-2008, 09:51 AM
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Re: What do you think about this work

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My hope is that whoever may see [my work] will draw some positive inspiration from it, perhaps no more than a momentary lifting of the burdens that they carry.
Pain and guilt can't be taken away with the wave of a magic wand. They're the things we carry with us, the things that make us who we are. If we lose them, we lose ourselves. I don't want my pain taken away! I need my pain!

- James T. Kirk, Star Trek: The Final Frontier
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  #10  
Old 11-15-2008, 10:07 AM
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Re: What do you think about this work

Prof. Evaldart I was worried you might have fallen off your pedestal last night on your way to the fridge to fetch another beer. So glad you made it.

Now that we are waking up to a glorious morning that feels like May, at least in California, one has to wonder about the meaning of "informs a primitve and absurd brand of restrained surrealism."
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  #11  
Old 11-15-2008, 10:22 AM
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Re: What do you think about this work

"Mille Sabords!" citing here Captain Haddock of the Tintin fame, the metal banging big muscle guys have no appreciation for the nuances of the delicate souls.

Burden does not have to refer to major torments or misery but to the pangs of existentialism normal beings experience from time to time.

And, Cheesepaw, I thought wretching pain as an engine of creativity had been outdated since the end of the age of "fin de siecle."

Last edited by zazie : 11-15-2008 at 11:22 AM. Reason: Fin de siecle is better than age of decadence which is now a 3D game
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  #12  
Old 11-15-2008, 10:27 AM
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Re: What do you think about this work

This thread is a nice short summary of why there are so many different types of artists and kinds of art out there.

Zazie seems to respond to a similar aspect of art as do I. Yet the work referenced here does not do that for me, partly for reasons mentioned by others, especially Mark. Then Cheesepaws implies a preference for an entirely different aesthetic, which I think that the work jOe mentioned did much to communicate, but then maybe that is entirely different then what CP had in mind. Evaldart is looking for heroic transformations in the artist, and as an aside, some art. There are a lot of things that I try to do with my work, and among those I find uplifting others to be as pertinent as pertinence.

The thing about technical skills that Zazie mentioned struck me because in the good 'ol days that aspect was a common-ground starting point, out of which the emotion then manifested, whereas today it is rarer and then somehow can become an end in it itself. For me, poor technique can stifle emotion just as much or more than can excellent technical skills. But it still comes down to what meaningful expression the artist is putting into the work, and who can pick-up on the message and be moved by it. Sometimes the brushwork of Xia Gui or Ma Yuan seems to say all that need be said, sometimes it is the chisel of Bernini or Bistolfi that does it. Rarely is it a US Duck stamp. For me. For someone else, it may be a duck stamp, Chet Atkins, and a velvet Elvis. Or Miro.
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  #13  
Old 11-15-2008, 11:16 AM
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Re: What do you think about this work

I was thinking some of the pieces on the website reminded me of Alexander Colville which led me to this site and more images and explanations.
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  #14  
Old 11-15-2008, 12:05 PM
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Re: What do you think about this work

Grommet, I cannot speak for your own experience but I see why Mady reminded you of Colville. They have something in common beyond medium and style.

When looking at their work one does not think about their technique, elaborate a narrative, or focus on the exquisite detailing.

Instead, their work holds us firmly in the *moment* .

Their work potentiates a known emotion or, by proxy, gives us a glimpse of an emotion that add to our repertoire. In this respect, their work is transformative: the artfulness of the object disappears and is totally irrelevant which, in terms of artistic intention, defines my personal quest.
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  #15  
Old 11-15-2008, 12:48 PM
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Re: What do you think about this work

From this side of the experience I was reminded of instances when a commonplace word or image is repeated often enough that it loses meaning and in a moment you are displaced and forced to get your bearings and see or hear anew. What was entirely familiar a few moments before is foreign seeming and fresh and yanks from you that sense of curiosity and wonder. Yes, in that moment there is no history, no prior knowledge; everything is alien.
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Old 11-15-2008, 03:14 PM
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Re: What do you think about this work

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From this side of the experience I was reminded of instances when a commonplace word or image is repeated often enough that it loses meaning and in a moment you are displaced and forced to get your bearings and see or hear anew. What was entirely familiar a few moments before is foreign seeming and fresh and yanks from you that sense of curiosity and wonder. Yes, in that moment there is no history, no prior knowledge; everything is alien.

And at that moment a new "word" enters the common dictionary.

Art is provocation if not, then decoration
RD
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Old 11-20-2008, 11:44 AM
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Re: What do you think about this work

This work feels goofy-cutesy-clumsy to me -- so when it's put into a public setting -- it would seem to promote cuteness and lovability beyond where they belong - i.e. the bedroom.

So I guess it's no coincidence that my favorite pieces of hers are the small, erotic couples.
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  #18  
Old 11-20-2008, 10:48 PM
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Re: What do you think about this work

Interesting to see the different perspectives but the consensus seems to be that Mady does not appeal to the American audience of this forum. Though she sells her bronzes (in limited editions as is the custom in Europe) as fast as she can produce them.

She has been a sculptor for many decades and she started via the traditional route, her current style evolved later. So, she is perfectly capable of producing anatomically correct pieces but she was fortunate to develop a style that is unique to her - something we all wish for ourselves.

I do not see her pieces as cute or clumsy what I see is the exuberance of life, the capture of the moment which she conveys in a stylized, sometimes, even cartoonish style that I enjoy. In fact, I think that developing a personal stylized style is much more difficult than producing anatomically correct pieces.
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Old 11-21-2008, 11:57 AM
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Re: What do you think about this work

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Interesting to see the different perspectives but the consensus seems to be that Mady does not appeal to the American audience of this forum. Though she sells her bronzes (in limited editions as is the custom in Europe) as fast as she can produce them.

She has been a sculptor for many decades and she started via the traditional route, her current style evolved later. So, she is perfectly capable of producing anatomically correct pieces but she was fortunate to develop a style that is unique to her - something we all wish for ourselves.

I do not see her pieces as cute or clumsy what I see is the exuberance of life, the capture of the moment which she conveys in a stylized, sometimes, even cartoonish style that I enjoy. In fact, I think that developing a personal stylized style is much more difficult than producing anatomically correct pieces.


I think of her as cutesy -- just like the popular European cinema that I don't care for (though I don't like today's Hollywood any better)

BTW - I am probably even less impressed by "anatomical correctness" than you are. That obsession is a real plague on the rebirth of figure sculpture. Academically, it's understandable because it gives students something objective to learn -- but usually they're also learning how to make things that are ugly.
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Old 01-13-2009, 09:05 AM
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Re: What do you think about this work

There’s a touch of sexual obsession here that hints at trashy emotional states and equally trashy art. Hand on cock...head between legs? Please! - I can imagine all that. Offer me something the local sex shop isn't offering.
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Old 01-13-2009, 12:30 PM
grommet grommet is offline
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Re: What do you think about this work

well gee, perhaps not everyone has been hanging out at the local sex shop to know...
Those pieces for me do have the tinge of new discovery/ new obsession. To be more valid they need to bring something else new... but I can appreciate her expression of enjoyment. It's not proper for ladies to do that, so you need to factor in the guts here.
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Old 01-14-2009, 02:21 AM
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Re: What do you think about this work

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... but I can appreciate her expression of enjoyment. It's not proper for ladies to do that, so you need to factor in the guts here.
Enjoyment is probably the right word. A few years ago, the lady sculptor got married to a man 30 years her junior. She has a tremendous joie de vivre.

Portoro, your choice words and your interpretation are your own issues not the sculptures and not what they depict.
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  #23  
Old 01-14-2009, 03:56 AM
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Re: What do you think about this work

Nah, I don’t think it has anything to do with private interpretation. There are objective standards to what makes good art, and we learn these by studying the tradition. Some work is simply limited in its horizons. All the great sculptures are profoundly complex, ALWAYS so in terms of content. I ask you to offer an interpretation of the couple (man/woman having oral sex, in ‘Les Couples’ section) that offers anything beyond the sexual act itself. This is ‘nothing’ art. At worst it is made for a ‘market’ (one with a limited emotional range), at best it is sheer obsession given form. It doesn’t deserve the name of art. And as for the form itself: hackneyed. For this piece to work you have to imagine the act itself – that’s not art, that’s porn. Great art takes on a life of its own when it has been completed. It does not depend on its subject to validate it. This piece cannot be extracted from the clunky idea behind it, or the emotional poverty. I refuse to have my horizons narrowed, so I refuse this work! Have a look at Picasso’s sexual work – a lesson in complexity, in vision, in original form, and even humour.
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Old 01-14-2009, 06:20 AM
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Re: What do you think about this work

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This piece cannot be extracted from the clunky idea behind it, or the emotional poverty. I refuse to have my horizons narrowed, so I refuse this work! Have a look at Picasso’s sexual work – a lesson in complexity, in vision, in original form, and even humour.
Maybe that's what she was after: humour. Look at her other work and the other couple sculpts. Those toes, legs, they're seem funny, don't they? She's an observer. Remove the humour and they would be porn. The humourous approach makes them art. And besides, she's French, isn't she? The statues seem to be in public spaces!
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Old 01-14-2009, 06:48 AM
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Re: What do you think about this work

Rika - yes, I see what you mean. I may have to take back everything I've said! I certainly also like the 'naivety' of the forms/modelling, and the comic simplicities of the figures (there is an innocence, even in their lovemaking, I can see now).
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