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  #1  
Old 04-30-2009, 11:49 AM
Phoenix Vendri Phoenix Vendri is offline
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getting a job

What is the name of the profession or job for the people that create the amazing 3d sculptures for Disney parks and props for other stores? I am trying to get into the profession from the ground up however I don't know exactly what its called to be able to find a job let alone a beginning to a career in it. Also if anyone has had a job in this field what are the key things that I must have full knowledge of to be qualified for such a career. Does anyone have any help to offer. Also I live all the way in Bayonne New Jersey
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  #2  
Old 04-30-2009, 01:05 PM
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GlennT GlennT is offline
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Re: getting a job

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Originally Posted by Phoenix Vendri View Post
What is the name of the profession or job for the people that create the amazing 3d sculptures for Disney parks and props for other stores? I am trying to get into the profession from the ground up however I don't know exactly what its called to be able to find a job
I don't know...maybe try the yellow pages under "Artistic Compromisers".
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Old 04-30-2009, 03:33 PM
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cheesepaws cheesepaws is offline
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Re: getting a job

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Originally Posted by GlennT View Post
I don't know...maybe try the yellow pages under "Artistic Compromisers".
That was a bit unfriendly Glenn. Not every sculptor is of the fine arts variety - nor should be.

Phoenix - the profession is one of sculptor. You might try digging around a bit on the internet under exhibition or trade show design. I am pretty sure that Disney is "in house."
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  #4  
Old 04-30-2009, 06:24 PM
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Re: getting a job

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Originally Posted by cheesepaws View Post
That was a bit unfriendly Glenn. Not every sculptor is of the fine arts variety - nor should be.
Fair enough. Call me unfriendly, as I watch our civilzation complacently slouching towards Gommorrah.

Meanwhile, if you wanted to find a job flipping burgers at McDonalds, would you contact a Cordon Bleu Chef website to ask what name those wonderful burger-flippers were called?
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Old 04-30-2009, 06:55 PM
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cheesepaws cheesepaws is offline
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Re: getting a job

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Originally Posted by GlennT View Post
Fair enough. Call me unfriendly, as I watch our civilzation complacently slouching towards Gommorrah.

Meanwhile, if you wanted to find a job flipping burgers at McDonalds, would you contact a Cordon Bleu Chef website to ask what name those wonderful burger-flippers were called?
I think that any site that can accommodate both MY work and YOUR work as "sculpture" - not to mention a good deal of potentially "marginal" work made by other members - is big enough to include commercial sculptors and questions by noobs and the curious. Also - likening this forum to one that serves the finest chefs is quite a silly comparison. Most of us ARE only "flippin' burgers"...on a good day.

So what's up with the 'tude? Spring still not arrived? Not enough time in the studio? Rude seems unlike you.
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  #6  
Old 04-30-2009, 08:18 PM
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evaldart evaldart is offline
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Re: getting a job

I could never get a job flippin burgers...I'd eat them all (seeing myself as more worthy of the fuel than the fast-fooders).

So...I AM a fast-fooder; a fast worker, a fast decider and a separator of existence's activities.
I have always said that Disney and the amusement parks can do better than the opulent Hirsts and the delegating Koons's. Yes, Get a job, make some big crazy stuff, hone some skills...all good; just dont forget about the Art. The bursts of pertinence. The paycheck and the Art sometimes know each other, but they certainly don't HAVE-to.

Last edited by evaldart : 04-30-2009 at 09:55 PM.
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  #7  
Old 04-30-2009, 08:19 PM
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fritchie fritchie is offline
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Re: getting a job

Phoenix - Clearly you have bumped into one of our regular friendly disagreements over the current and future state of the profession of sculpture.
What you are looking for goes under various names because the field is relatively new and constantly changing. The earliest name was something like "computer graphics", but that mainly is 2D only. 3D things like you describe go under names like "computer modeling" and "computer manufacture". Use that term to search Google, and you will learn more as you search.

Also, as was said above, Disney generally uses only its' internal company artists.
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  #8  
Old 04-30-2009, 09:21 PM
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Re: getting a job

Mea culpa. Every day as Obama and company move to nationalize another industry; banks, the automobile industry, energy ( through the "cap and trade" farce), health care...it begins to worry me about the future of this country. So I guess this person perfectly content to flip sculpture burgers hit me as a general symptom of the willingness to be sheep to the treadmill of the easy path without considering the possible value of one's time on earth to help advance civilization.

I could be mistaken, it could be that if Disney and theme parks and the movie industry weren't paying people to make monsters and astral images and wacked-out superheroes, that of their own volition and artistic inspiration and temperment these people would be doing this kind of work because of a burning desire to advance civilization by creating such images.

I don't object to the job aspect of this pursuit, and the pluses that evaldart mentions. But if you are content with that path then don't complain about the Walmart phenomena either. I just see it all as a dumbing down of our culture and I may have unfairly unloaded on Phoenix Vendri for which I apologize.
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  #9  
Old 05-01-2009, 03:03 AM
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Re: getting a job

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Originally Posted by GlennT View Post
I just see it all as a dumbing down of our culture and I may have unfairly unloaded on Phoenix Vendri for which I apologize.
There are those in every generation that think this is the worst one. I can just imageine you on your street corner on your upturned crate shouting 'the end is nigh, repent and make the art that I find acceptable in the manner that fits my romantic notion how life should be.'

Here's a few questions: Do you spend an excessive amount of time baulking at or railing against certain things in life that you don't like? Do you get a little angry about them and have to vent ocassionally (well, we know the answer to that one), does that in turn make you think more and try to focus and understand the negative aspects of what you see around you so you can explain them fully and articulate with some kind of satisfaction. Do you attract negative feedback because your outlook and opinions that you feel you must express? Does that make you think more about the negative subjects and want to justify your outlook?

Do you see where this is going? I know from being on this forum that the answer many of these should be 'yes', but I am sure you want to say 'no' !

Last edited by LimeCutter : 05-01-2009 at 03:15 AM.
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Old 05-01-2009, 08:38 AM
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Re: getting a job

Quote:
I could be mistaken, it could be that if Disney and theme parks and the movie industry weren't paying people to make monsters and astral images and wacked-out superheroes, that of their own volition and artistic inspiration and temperment these people would be doing this kind of work because of a burning desire to advance civilization by creating such images.
As technology advances and we find new and better ways to do things there's an unsightly buildup of what has been termed 'leisure time' (shudder). What to do with this unsightly waxy bulidup?... Well you could pray for the souls of the damned (democrats), or play soccer, read a book, ride a bike, play with your kids, surprise your wife, take your family to Disney, see a movie, learn to clog... You get the point. If we're gonna criticize someone for enjoying building castles and wide-eyed critters we might also look at excessive soccer references.
The press for survival less critical, we can find many ways to explore and amuse ourselves. Good thing everyone didn't choose the same thing, or we'd still be in line for that 3-D movie. And that frolicking produces jobs that just might be fun. What's your problem with fun? Somebody has to be in charge of producing fun, or there won't be enough to go around.
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  #11  
Old 05-01-2009, 08:54 AM
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Re: getting a job

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Originally Posted by LimeCutter View Post
There are those in every generation that think this is the worst one.
Actually, I think we are still a bit better than the generations of Caligula, Nero, and those who caused the fall of Atlantis, to name a few. So, there is a bright side!

Plus, I do like Tweety bird on occasion.
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  #12  
Old 05-01-2009, 02:19 PM
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Re: getting a job

This is why I stopped coming to this forum for so many months, and I can see that things haven't changed. Glenn, you and I have always shared friendly words and I think we have an equal respect for eachother's work. Would you call me a "Sculptural Burger Flipper" because I was trying to find commercial work in this economy. The challenge and artistic skill it takes to create things for Disney or otherwise, is huge. Attention to detail, ability to capture a likeness (cartoon or otherwise), working large scale as well as creating tiny sculptures. This forum has it's share of commercial guys who share their work every once in a while (myself included), and they've always been welcomed to share their work and ask questions. If phoenix wants to ask about finding work in this field, we should be encouraging and supportive. We are a "Community" after all.

Phoenix, what you're looking for is called commercial sculpting. Disney is a hard company to get work for, but you can try doing some research on the Disney Imageneering http://corporate.disney.go.com/caree...gineering.html
I worked for a company called Dinamation, they did exactly what you're talking about, from animitronic life sized dinosaurs, to dragons, to whales and massive insects. Props, still figures and moving creatures. It was a lot of fun and I learned a lot. Things you'll need to know are: Sculpting in Foam, using resins and textures stamps, Oil based clay is a must, and you might want to learn how to sculpt in toy waxes (or industrial waxes), as this is becoming more of an industry standard. You need to be really good at copying a 2D form into 3D, capturing a likeness and creating life like textures. Mold making will also come in handy, so learn about different mold making techniques (mainly for transfer of materials - final production molding is done by molding professionals).

I didn't see where you lived, but if you're in Southern California, that's a good start. You'll find a bunch of places out here. If you don't have a good portfolio you are not likely to get hired anywhere. These places are hard to find as they don't advertise. You might be able to look some places up by doing some research on the credits of movies and t.v. shows, look for places that have props and stuff and ask the company who they used for those things. Little by little you'll get closer. You also may have to start with an unpaid internship (which means you'll be sweeping floors and stuff), but it's a good way to get a foot in the door.

Good Luck to you, it's not easy but if you don't give up, you'll find success.

Cheers!!!

Alfred
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  #13  
Old 05-01-2009, 03:21 PM
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Re: getting a job

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Originally Posted by Alfred View Post
This is why I stopped coming to this forum for so many months, and I can see that things haven't changed. Glenn, you and I have always shared friendly words and I think we have an equal respect for eachother's work. Would you call me a "Sculptural Burger Flipper" because I was trying to find commercial work in this economy.
Alfred
There is no denying that there is learning and skill involved in doing commercial work in the gaming, prop, and movie industry. For the most part, I critique art, and I have enjoyed looking at the art you have posted. I have little to say in regards to the "art" aspect of the toy-like commercial work. In a perfect world your art would be a sufficient means for satisfying all of your needs for learning, growth, and earning an income. I'm hoping that as you orient yourself more and more towards the commercial work, where consistently tight surface detail everywhere is so important, you don't lose the sensitivity and vison of the artist in your art work. This has happened to a number of famous 2-D illustrators in the past, who had so long ingrained the illustration approach and aesthetic in their work that they were unable to free themselves of it to create good fine art paintings.

This issue may or may not be important to you or others who pursue the commercial route, but that is my perspective. Should I not voice it because it might make you or others uncomfortable to read it on this forum? There are gaming forum sites that are ideal for the support and commraderie of those who do that type of work. I acknowledge that this is a general forum welcome to all types of sculpting. There is enough variety in the members here that if I choose to give voice to a certain standard, there are others who have completely different ideas and will be willing to add their perspective.

Even though the fundamentals of gaming sculpture are more akin to my background than are welded steel and found object art, I am more likely to appreciate a well designed and considered abstract piece than yet another monster full of incredibly realistic gore or a sexually-hyped up cartoon figure.
I consider not just how such work advances a person's career, but how these things may effect society and its values. Since those issues matter to me, I respond accordingly.
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Old 05-01-2009, 08:45 PM
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Re: getting a job

"This issue may or may not be important to you or others who pursue the commercial route, but that is my perspective. Should I not voice it because it might make you or others uncomfortable to read it on this forum? There are gaming forum sites that are ideal for the support and commraderie of those who do that type of work. I acknowledge that this is a general forum welcome to all types of sculpting. There is enough variety in the members here that if I choose to give voice to a certain standard, there are others who have completely different ideas and will be willing to add their perspective."

Glenn, of course you can voice your opinion on any matter that you want. But when a new person comes to this forum, genuinely seeking this communities help, that is not the place for your opinions. If you have something constructive to add to their questions, then feel free to post it, but if you want to high-jack someone's thread to start an unwarranted attack on what that person was trying to learn about, then that's just wrong - I would expect more understanding and compassion from you. If you want to discuss your views on how the art world is going to hell, or the country is failing and morals are falling away here and there, then you should start your own thread and all those who feel like banging their heads against a wall can join you in there. This was a completely simple question from someone looking to get their start in this very difficult line of work. You should be happy that at least he's trying to get work sculpting rather than what I had to do - work construction for ten years and create little to no art at all. Normally I would send this in a PM, but I wanted to put it out there in public view so that others that felt like attacking someone who just wanted some help, might think twice about it.

Alfred
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  #15  
Old 05-01-2009, 10:37 PM
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Re: getting a job

Well Alfred, you are right about correcting my greeting a new person with my opinion in this context. I think part of what prompted my response was that the person was in effect saying, "I'm looking for a job...anybody know what this job is called so I can look for it?" Which struck me as an odd and somewhat comical lack of knowing what one is doing, in addition to the other stuff of which my opinion is based. So, I thought, wrongly in hindsight, that I should reply with some kind of clever quip. and then it went on and on from there...

I'll try for better restraint in the future.
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Old 05-01-2009, 11:32 PM
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Re: getting a job

I was in a booth next to Seth Vandable at Loveland's Sculpture in the Park show last year, and he has done superheroes and what not for the comic companies.
He was very approachable and friendly and if you googled him and asked I'm sure he would be able to throw you some hints.
Other than that, you could look up some schools in Southern California and find some character sculpture classes, and perhaps take them to get inside info from who ever teaches them, assuming they have worked for Disney and the like (many will have done would be my guess).
Good luck,
Cheers,
Steve.
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  #17  
Old 05-02-2009, 02:47 AM
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Re: getting a job

"Modelmaker". i've done it. You can pick up a lot of skills, play with different industrial materials, & earn a buck doing it. i've done fibreglass moulding as a job too & that taught me heaps of useful skills including how to sand.
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Old 05-02-2009, 10:26 AM
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Re: getting a job

Phoenix Vendri

Imagineers

disney calls 'em
IMAGINEERS
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  #19  
Old 05-03-2009, 12:45 PM
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Re: getting a job

Phoenix dont worry about what some of the fools on this sight would say. Befor you leave this forum please give it another chance. There are lots of amazing sculptors on here who would be able to give you pointers about the field you are interested in. Alfred is one of them take a look at some of his recent posts.
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  #20  
Old 05-04-2009, 07:46 AM
EJB EJB is offline
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Re: getting a job

Hey PV,
Don't worry about what it is called, just start doing it. Don't wait for someone to give you a job or permission to develop your skills. This type of work generally requires you to prove yourself many times over before anyone cuts you a paycheck. Seek out any and all opportunities to learn and market your skills. If you don't have access to the latest and greatest tools and materials, innovate. Carve stuff out of mashed potatoes if you have to. (Just gotta figure out who then wants mashed potato carvings). Offer up your services to local businesses and organizations as a means of supporting your education before taking on Hollywood. Start networking or even apprentice with someone who does this type of work. Volunteer to build parade floats, holiday displays, enter store window contests, etc.
Not sure about your immediate area but you might want to investigate The Compleat Sculptor in NYC. They have supplies and workshops and a network of many people in the industry.
If you do end up making the mashed potato carvings, let me know if I can get that deep fried.
Good luck!
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  #21  
Old 05-04-2009, 04:54 PM
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WillPaq WillPaq is offline
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Re: getting a job

One of my closest friends worked for Disney in Florida for several years. They are not too artist friendly there, so if you go into the biz just expect it to be day work with little reward and where you can learn some new skills or hone your existing skills.

Nothing wrong with commercial work if that's what you want to do. Whatever floats your artistic boat is where you should be.
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  #22  
Old 05-05-2009, 05:51 PM
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Re: getting a job

look up Ron Mueck, he started in the entertainment industry and is now very big in contemporary figurative sculpture. Use his path as a guide for you to follow.
Matt
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  #23  
Old 05-19-2009, 03:28 PM
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oddist oddist is offline
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Re: getting a job

So, making a sculpture for a church is more of an artistic venture than making a sculpture for a theme park?

What's wrong with this picture?

There's enough room for everyone.
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"Important artists are innovators whose work changes the practices of their successors; important works of art are those that embody these innovations."
Galenson, David W. Old Masters and young geniuses, Princeton University Press, 2006
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  #24  
Old 05-19-2009, 07:15 PM
Phoenix Vendri Phoenix Vendri is offline
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Re: getting a job

Thank you so much for the information, alfred, I really apprectiate it. And glenn I keep seeing you on forums as really negative why don't you take some time away from the computer and focus that obvious energy and anger towards your work because frankly I don't need to hear it. Also for those who showed support I have begun an apprenticeship with a very good sculptor so things are falling together

Last edited by Phoenix Vendri : 05-19-2009 at 07:32 PM.
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  #25  
Old 05-20-2009, 07:40 AM
grommet grommet is offline
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Re: getting a job

Glad to hear things are going well.
Don't be too hard on Glenn, he is mortally wounded that his candidate is not President, and will most likely be a pill periodically for the duration. He is finding it hard to find the beauty when things are not his way.
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